Episode 139 - The Power of Effective Online Advertising With Mike Edge
Mike Edge [00:00:00]:
Um.
Lucas Underwood [00:00:02]:
We are very much just like, lay back, chill.
Mike Edge [00:00:06]:
We.
Lucas Underwood [00:00:06]:
The conversations we have are just basically the same thing. Did you actually figure out how to clap this time?
David Roman [00:00:12]:
So, missed just one time.
Mike Edge [00:00:16]:
What were we clapping for there?
Lucas Underwood [00:00:18]:
Well, he's syncing his audio. He tries to look at himself to make sure he's clapping, and he misses his hand.
David Roman [00:00:27]:
That's the most awkward thing when you're like.
Mike Edge [00:00:31]:
It's like two guys that are trying to give high five. Yeah.
David Roman [00:00:33]:
And they miss each other. That's exactly what it feels like. But you're doing it with yourself, so it's even worse.
Mike Edge [00:00:37]:
My youngest son, the what I was just talking about, he and I will have that awkward moment once in a while, and I'll try to be like, he's coming in for the high five, and I'm doing the fist bump. He'll just grab my hand, he goes, it's all right, dad. Gear shift.
Lucas Underwood [00:00:53]:
There you go. That's trade show life anymore, right? You just don't even know how to handle it. Scoot right up on that mic. Up as close as you can.
Mike Edge [00:01:01]:
Can I lock this thing in? I don't know.
Lucas Underwood [00:01:03]:
It might. I've been sliding back and forth. Oh, yeah, it does lock. There's one button. You push it down, it locks the back one.
Mike Edge [00:01:13]:
No.
Lucas Underwood [00:01:16]:
It just, like, flops straight down. It's on the right hand side. I don't guess yours works.
Mike Edge [00:01:25]:
Mine doesn't work. That's all right. We'll make it work.
Lucas Underwood [00:01:28]:
You just got to remember. I don't know. I mean, we're just as bad as anybody.
Mike Edge [00:01:32]:
All right.
Lucas Underwood [00:01:33]:
Introduce yourself, please, sir.
Mike Edge [00:01:35]:
Right now?
Lucas Underwood [00:01:36]:
Yeah, sure.
Mike Edge [00:01:36]:
Mike Edge out of Owensboro, Kentucky, work with a company called Tread Partners. We also run a podcast called Gain Traction.
Lucas Underwood [00:01:44]:
Very cool.
Mike Edge [00:01:45]:
Married with five kids. Got my first grandbaby this year.
Lucas Underwood [00:01:48]:
Man. David, do you want grandbabies?
David Roman [00:01:51]:
I want a ton of grandbabies.
Lucas Underwood [00:01:54]:
Really?
David Roman [00:01:54]:
I want so many.
Mike Edge [00:01:55]:
Yeah.
Lucas Underwood [00:01:56]:
I don't know. I don't think I'm to the point I've thought about it yet.
Mike Edge [00:01:58]:
Well, I'm going to tell you something. It is as special as everybody says it is. It's beyond that, actually. It was hard for you hear people say, oh, it's awesome. You can't believe how much love you're going to have for this new child in your life, et cetera. But it's better than that. It's hard to put your hands around because you don't know what to compare it to, right?
Lucas Underwood [00:02:22]:
When my daughter was born, the very first telephone call I made was to my parents. And I said, I am so sorry. And they said, what do you mean? I said, I never realized how much you all love me. This is different.
Mike Edge [00:02:37]:
Dude, that's awesome.
Lucas Underwood [00:02:38]:
And you think about it, you go into this and you think that you know what love is. And you have these relationships throughout your life, and you're going through this stuff. But boys, when that young and cries for the first time, there is something primal in here that changes about you. And you love that thing, that little child, more than you could ever imagine loving anything else. It's like old boy. The other day, we recorded with this guy who told his story. I think David and I were both sitting over here in horror at hearing this guy's story. He was in the Chicago newspapers when he was 13 years old because he'd been abused so terribly and been through just this terrible life.
Lucas Underwood [00:03:21]:
And I'm like, man. And it wasn't his parents that did that. He had been moved from parent to parent to parent and that kind of deal. But I don't see how people that actually had that child could harm that child. You know what I'm saying? Yeah, it's crazy.
David Roman [00:03:36]:
Those people are out of their mind.
Lucas Underwood [00:03:38]:
They're just broken.
Mike Edge [00:03:39]:
Yeah, we're all broken to a degree. Yeah, that's what this is.
David Roman [00:03:43]:
A different level of broken.
Mike Edge [00:03:46]:
That's what I mean, though. He's at one of the highest degrees. And it's nothing but compassion. You can only have compassion on somebody like that. I've seen some bad cases, and I got involved in, actually, because of a friend. And at first I was really skeptical, but I got involved in jail ministry. Really? Yeah. And, man, I'll tell you right now, I love jailbirds.
Mike Edge [00:04:09]:
Really? Oh, yeah. When they hit rock bottom and they're not on alcohol or the drugs that usually the hole they went down or whatever, man, they're solid people. Some of them just. Now, don't get me wrong, there are some rotten scoundrels.
Lucas Underwood [00:04:27]:
Of course they're never going to change.
Mike Edge [00:04:29]:
They ain't going to change. But there are some that you see. You see the light in their eye and you're just like, man, this guy's got it. He's just stuck in these.
Lucas Underwood [00:04:41]:
Remember, you know, George that works for me. You've probably not met him, but George is here today. And George, when he got out of. And prison, creates a structure, you know what saying.
Mike Edge [00:04:55]:
Yep.
Lucas Underwood [00:04:55]:
And it gives them a routine and it gives them something. This is what I do, and I do it this time. And this is how I do it. And it keeps them away from those other people in a lot of cases, because the people are the are you become who you're. And so, you know, George, when he came out, man, he really got on lockdown. He'd got his health under control, he had got his weight under control, and he's let things slip. He's been through some hard times since then. But I was telling David the other day, there's a guy in town, his name's Kevin.
Lucas Underwood [00:05:27]:
He owns the most popular barber shop in town, and it is lined up four, five weeks. No problem, right. To get an appointment and just absolutely seven days a week. Dude, he typically take off Sunday afternoon, but, I mean, he's open six days a week every single week. Sometimes, if he's real busy, he'll come in on Sunday. Right.
Mike Edge [00:05:46]:
Wow.
Lucas Underwood [00:05:47]:
And the deal is, as you talk to him, you go in first couple of times, he cuts your hair, and you don't really think much about it. Then you start talking to him. Kevin, where'd you learn to cut hair? Prison. Really. And you start digging into that story, and you learn that Kevin got in some trouble. And then when he was in there, they said, hey, we've got some cosmetology and some barber stuff that you can learn and some stuff that you can do. And so Kevin begins to learn, begins taking steps to making things better in his own life. And he said, I don't ever want to be like this again.
Lucas Underwood [00:06:19]:
I don't ever want to be in this situation again. And the only people I know at home are in the trade that I know how to do. And so if I go out and I start My own thing and I get out and I don't go back anywhere around those people, and I just put my head down and go to work, I'll find my own way. I don't have to be like this anymore. So after, I think it was four years in prison, he gets out and he starts a barbershop. And then little by little, he gets more and more popular, and it just takes off. It's unbelievable.
Mike Edge [00:06:52]:
Well, and then the other neat thing about him, he seems to have the discipline. Not that he has to work that way the rest of his life, but he's doing it now to keep himself occupied. It seems like probably to work extra or keep that extra day on. Yeah.
Lucas Underwood [00:07:06]:
And I think that's a big thing for them, because there's a lot of those lifestyles that the thought process and the anxiety, the depression, whatever it is that's constantly rolling up here, they end up heading back down that pathway if they're not careful, because we get so used to it. I remember I had a business coach one time, and he kept telling me, he said, life is like the ruts in the road that the tractor made. And he said, the longer we drive in those ruts, the deeper they get. And he said, unfortunately, the problem is you're going in a big circle. And he said, you can create some new ruts, but those other ruts will always be there. If you ever fall back into those ruts, you've got to actively pull yourself out. Back out of them.
Mike Edge [00:07:51]:
That's a good visual, Lucas. Yeah, that really is. I can picture that. Yeah. I've got a really good friend of mine that can't get out of his rut. A grade school went all the way through high school with him and everything. And just one of those situations and you can't help somebody. They really have to want to help themselves.
Mike Edge [00:08:12]:
And I know he wants to, but it's been so easy for him to fall back into his ruts. And all I know do is be a friend. Try not to. Enabling him. That's a hard one.
Lucas Underwood [00:08:24]:
Yeah, that's a hard one.
Mike Edge [00:08:25]:
I didn't realize there's so many ways of enabling him. Yeah. You know what I mean?
Lucas Underwood [00:08:28]:
Absolutely.
Mike Edge [00:08:29]:
It's not like you're doing bad things with him, but you can enable by just doing some small things where he needs to take care of some certain things on his own.
Lucas Underwood [00:08:37]:
Amen, buddy. Yeah, right. And that comes back to that personal responsibility. Because if you allow them, I shouldn't say them, but if you allow someone to find themselves in a situation like that to where they have to make a choice, it's those repetitive choices that helps get them to where they're making good choices. Right. And if we constantly bail them out of bad choices, those choices never become painful enough that it's like, ooh, well.
Mike Edge [00:09:06]:
You don't realize it, but you're not being caring or loving. You think you are in the sense that you instinctively. I just want to help him out of this current circumstance. Right. Yeah, but you're not helping him. He's going to have to feel the pain and that's just the reality.
Lucas Underwood [00:09:23]:
Absolutely.
Mike Edge [00:09:24]:
I think a lot of times I look back, he didn't come from a wealthy family or anything, but just a middle class family. But I think his parents spoiled him in some ways because they bailed him out. Let's just put it blunt. They just bailed him out. He never had to pay too many penalties for certain errors. And then you stay on that course.
Lucas Underwood [00:09:44]:
It unravels and it gets worse, and it gets worse.
Mike Edge [00:09:47]:
And then you look up one day and you're married, then you have a kid, then he's divorced and he's back on the streets. And it's just for our friend group, it's a terrible thing to witness because you can't help the guy, right?
Lucas Underwood [00:10:01]:
Like you said, sometimes trying to help, we end up doing more harm than we did in good. And it's hard to get moving. I know it sucks to see. And I've seen a lot of people go that route and I've seen a lot of people who have overcome it.
Mike Edge [00:10:15]:
Oh, yeah.
Lucas Underwood [00:10:16]:
And it comes back in some ways. I've seen shop owners do it with technicians. Right?
Mike Edge [00:10:22]:
Yeah.
Lucas Underwood [00:10:23]:
And the thing is, what I've learned about addicts, what I've learned about people who live these lifestyles, is this is about an attitude more than it is about a drug. This is about a mindset more than it is about alcohol, right? This is the way that we perceive the world. This is the way that we think about things. And so if they have that mindset and the world's against them, and this will make me feel better. I don't want to call it laziness.
Mike Edge [00:10:52]:
But it does become extremely selfish. They just want 100% self centered.
Lucas Underwood [00:10:58]:
Everything in life is about how this affects me, how you affect me, how every single thing you say and do is about me. Right?
Mike Edge [00:11:07]:
Oh, yeah. This guy, to give you an example, I'm real good friends with his dad because I've seen him out in town and the hometown I'm from, and we don't even talk about it anymore. Right. It's a downer. But when I've talked to the son, he's kind of complained to me, like, dad's completely cut me off and everything. I said, man, I'm on your dad's side here, bud. After there's some terrible things that have happened between their relationship, all instigated by the son, and the dad's tolerated it to a point where finally he had to, just for his own benefit, own financial security, because he's an older man now and all kinds of things. He said, these are the rules in our relationship.
Mike Edge [00:11:47]:
If you're not going to abide by them, I can't do anything more for.
Lucas Underwood [00:11:50]:
You or with you.
Mike Edge [00:11:52]:
The son told me one time he thought his dad was being cruel, and I said, no, he's not. He's actually loving you now.
Lucas Underwood [00:11:57]:
Exactly. I've got a good friend of mine who has got ten years in prison right now. Oh, wow. And the thing was that, and I feel bad for the dad in a lot of ways, because the dad was a hard ass. The dad wasn't as caring and loving as he should have been as a father. And I don't want to say the dad's a narcissist, but the dad had some attitude problems, right? Nice guy, smart guy. Love him to death, not say anything bad about him, but I've witnessed this from the outside looking in, and I've seen how he acted just like his dad did. Now, the deal was that dad basically hooked up with this crackhead, and she got pregnant, and they had a son, and she dipped out.
Lucas Underwood [00:12:46]:
And so dad always resented the mother. And so dad, every decision he made, everything he said to his son was a direct correlation that interesting of how mom was and how he thought about mom and how he felt about Mom. And so, ever since we were kids, man, I've watched this guy just make bad decision. And he's so funny. He's so charismatic. He has so much potential. Bad decision after bad decision after bad decision.
Mike Edge [00:13:15]:
Isn't that amazing?
Lucas Underwood [00:13:17]:
I remember I was in my first high speed police chase with him. Went to the right first.
Mike Edge [00:13:25]:
I like that.
Lucas Underwood [00:13:26]:
We drove by the police station. He had this old F 150, and he had a switch on the fuel pump because the ECM wasn't controlling the fuel pump anymore. So he would reach up, he'd leave the fuel pump switch on, he'd cut the switch off on the truck, and when he cut the switch back on, it'd fire the coal, and when it fired the coal, it'd pop. And so he had the police department thinking he was shooting at him because he'd pop it out the exhaust every time we went by. And he just thought it was the funniest thing ever.
Mike Edge [00:13:53]:
Right?
Lucas Underwood [00:13:55]:
It's funny because his dad does some of the same stuff, right? Like, it's somewhat of this rebellious thing. And I'll never forget, this boy goes to see his mom, all right? And he goes out and he sees his mom for the first time since he's been actively building memories. Yeah, right? She reaches out, she wants to get in contact with him, and he came back. And I'll never forget him walking through the door and saying, I know why I am the way I am now. And I'm like, what does that mean? You know what I mean? And he said, a lot of the things I've said and done are very much like my mom.
Mike Edge [00:14:29]:
Wow.
Lucas Underwood [00:14:30]:
He gets sent to prison, and the dad says, he said that. He said, I've realized now that it was me because I treated him like I was treating his mother. I was treating him like I thought his mother should be treated. I was treating him like he acted like his mother. And he said, I was the one who raised him. This is on me, not on him.
Mike Edge [00:14:54]:
Wow.
Lucas Underwood [00:14:54]:
You know what I mean?
Mike Edge [00:14:55]:
Yeah.
Lucas Underwood [00:14:55]:
And that's tough to think back because, I mean, this kid could have done so many things. He was a hard worKer, he was smart, he was at it. He was capable of doing anything he put his mind to, but he just. Man, every single mistake got worse and got worse, and people tried and tried to help him, but each time they helped him, they removed the consequence. And because the consequence never hurt enough, he never found a new path. That said, I need to go a different direction. I think it's a ten year sentence.
David Roman [00:15:28]:
That's crazy.
Lucas Underwood [00:15:29]:
And, I mean, it's not a sentence that can be changed.
Mike Edge [00:15:31]:
Yeah, right.
Lucas Underwood [00:15:32]:
Because every sentence he had, the judge would come back in, he'd get paroled or something would happen, and he never, ever had to actually serve the time. And so now he's in fed, caught up to him, and he says, this is not county jail. What do you mean? Well, I can't make jokes. And they laugh with me here. Yeah, that sucks, doesn't it? He's like, I'm going to get my ass kicked here. That sucks, man.
Mike Edge [00:16:01]:
Yeah. What do you say to that? Because he's in a truly a new lifestyle and he's stuck. There's no altering it for the moment. Yeah.
Lucas Underwood [00:16:11]:
And I think of all the things I worry about for my kids because I can't control what they say and do.
Mike Edge [00:16:18]:
Yeah.
Lucas Underwood [00:16:18]:
I can't control their actions. I can teach them now that that's bad and it's not okay to act that way. I can show them through my actions what a good human being does. I can't control it. I can't control the decisions they make. That makes me a little bit nervous. And like, growing up, I was a big pothead. I was involved with meth when I was a kid.
Lucas Underwood [00:16:43]:
That is not the same thing now. Right. Because fentanyl is in everything.
Mike Edge [00:16:48]:
Yeah.
David Roman [00:16:49]:
That'll kill them easily.
Mike Edge [00:16:51]:
Right.
Lucas Underwood [00:16:51]:
Well, I mean, I've seen like five or six people right across the Tennessee line in Johnson City. They reported on the news the other night that there had been six overdose deaths in the last day. That's pretty substantial.
Mike Edge [00:17:07]:
Substantial, yes.
Lucas Underwood [00:17:09]:
And that's everywhere in the country.
David Roman [00:17:11]:
100,000 deaths. I'm fentanyl overdose in one year.
Lucas Underwood [00:17:16]:
100,000 as a parent.
Mike Edge [00:17:18]:
Yeah.
Lucas Underwood [00:17:19]:
That's terrifying.
Mike Edge [00:17:20]:
It is. I tell you, my kids are older now. My youngest is 16. But somewhere along the way, the Lord hit me on the head, and I just realized I had to keep them close to God, pray as a family, make them realize there's a greater power beyond dad and beyond this little world right here so that you can think about things more with wisdom versus just that instant pleasure. Right. And I give the credit to God for my kids. Now, they do have a lot of maturity to them, and sometimes I look at them, I go, I don't know how you make the decisions you make, because I didn't make those decisions. I did a lot of screwing up, but they make a lot more mature decisions.
Mike Edge [00:18:08]:
And as a dad, I love seeing that, if that makes sense, for sure, 100%. Well, they don't know all my mistakes either. It's not like I tell them.
Lucas Underwood [00:18:18]:
Well, I mean, here's the thing, though, is I think when you see that, you've got to breathe a sigh of relief because there's one or two ways that it can go. There's a lot of ways it can go, but there's good or bad.
Mike Edge [00:18:32]:
And I'm not saying they're angels by any means. I'm just saying there's a level of maturity I recognize my kids have that I didn't have a certain age.
Lucas Underwood [00:18:42]:
Absolutely. Well, I mean, that's what I'm saying, is that there's got to be a sigh of relief in there. That's saying, I feel pretty confident you're going to make good decisions. You know what I mean? Like, I'm sure you're going to do something stupid, but the number of trees that I smacked with automobiles and the number of fights that I got in, I feel really bad for mom and Dad.
Mike Edge [00:19:07]:
That's the thing. So we have a little bit similar past. You mentioned those two things right there. My driving always been made fun of, bad driving, whatever. I was involved in a lot of accidents. Really had no concept of what insurance costs until you get your own kids. Yeah. So my dad died approximately 19 years ago, and I still look up to heaven.
Mike Edge [00:19:27]:
I'll go, dad, first of all, I'm sorry.
Lucas Underwood [00:19:31]:
Yeah, amen.
Mike Edge [00:19:32]:
And second of all, thank you. Because didn't give up on. He just. He was always. My dad was a fun loving guy, but he had his discipline lines and stuff. But he also knew how to raise. I came from five boys and two girls. So he knew how to raise five sons.
Mike Edge [00:19:45]:
And one of the best things I could say about my dad was he never let the little bulls think they could control the house. The big bull was always in charge. Now that I've raised my kids, that's the hard part of raising kids, is the consistency. You get tired. And I saw my dad change. I mean, I was at the top of the line, and the discipline was harder, but then he got a little more relaxed with my younger brothers, but at the same time, he's still disciplined. It was just different ways. I said, dad, you would have busted our ass if we did that.
Mike Edge [00:20:19]:
And he goes, you get a little smarter about how to handle things, and you get tired for sure. There's a balance dealing with your kids or whatnot, but, yeah, talking about the driving, how many cars you bang up or something. So I've got drivers. Well, I worry about my kids out in the road now, so I can't imagine them getting a phone call. Your son Mike's been involved in another, right? Then they're thinking, bottom, what's wrong with him? Or is he okay or. Yeah, and then the fights that you get into or whatever, just good old friendly fights.
Lucas Underwood [00:21:01]:
But the world's a different place, though. I mean, there was a kid that I knew and had hung out with for years shot and killed right in front of bojangles in our tiny little town.
Mike Edge [00:21:11]:
Oh, gosh.
Lucas Underwood [00:21:12]:
And it was road rage. And if you knew how many cars that I had walked up to and let somebody know what I thought, and he walked up to the driver's side of the car, and the guy felt threatened for his life, and he pulled a pistol and shot and killed him. Had a three week old baby in the car with bad decision.
David Roman [00:21:34]:
I grew up in the Northeast. We didn't have guns.
Lucas Underwood [00:21:37]:
That's what's wrong with you.
David Roman [00:21:39]:
I'm just telling you. You didn't worry about that. That is still prevalent today. You will get people walking up to your window because you didn't use the turn signal long enough or at all. People are nuts out here. You get shot anywhere else in the country, like, what are you talking about? You don't know who's got a gun. You walk up to somebody's window and tap on it like you're about to do something, they'll just shoot you. We don't have that out here.
David Roman [00:22:04]:
It's like, yeah, well, don't do it anywhere else in the country.
Lucas Underwood [00:22:06]:
I know where you're from, and so very similar to here.
Mike Edge [00:22:13]:
You don't walk up to somebody's house late at night without a little caution or their car when they're in it, especially an old man, you will turn into Swiss cheese mighty quick. Yeah. There's a lot of truth to that. But my dad used to have this little phrase sometimes, and I don't know, he really never cussed, but once in a while, he would say, I can tell you hadn't had your ass whipped in a while.
Lucas Underwood [00:22:42]:
Right.
Mike Edge [00:22:43]:
And what that meant was basically an attitude adjustment. And he could see it. He hated arrogant people, too, or smart asses. And he'd say, I can tell that guy hadn't had ass kicking in a while, and that was just the way he looked at things. Somebody needs to square him up. And that's why you just didn't mess with some of those older men when.
Lucas Underwood [00:23:04]:
You were growing up. I'm telling thing, because that's the same way around our hometown, is that you knew, and maybe that's small town America. David's just never experienced small town America, I guess. But I remember as I grew up, my parents, I don't want to say they were prominent in town, but everybody knew them. And so I remember 132 miles an hour. 135 miles an hour. Ticket in Walmart parking lot that got taken care of. I did ask for a copy, and they said they were taking me to jail if they gave me a copy.
Mike Edge [00:23:39]:
Right. Yeah.
Lucas Underwood [00:23:40]:
I remember my cousin, who was a police officer, saying, do you want me to call your mama, or do you want to go home? I'm going home. You know what that was? That was the America that I grew up in. But by gosh, I also knew that there were some people I better not mouth off to.
Mike Edge [00:23:57]:
Oh, yeah.
Lucas Underwood [00:23:58]:
And you treated them with respect, and that's just what it. You know, I don't want to say that we should go around being aggressive with people. That's not the point. IT's that when there is a risk associated with your behavior and there's a consequence for your actions, yes. All of a sudden, it's a different conversation to have.
Mike Edge [00:24:25]:
So you got a really good instinct for what I'm about to say. So my dad, to me, had a perfect balance. And what I would call it is he was a protector and a provider, but a protector in the sense that whoever he was with, if he felt like somebody was being done wrong or, let's say, put in a bad situation or whatever, buddy, he's going to stand up and check that person. And he had that old school mentality that, well, nobody else is going to do it. I'm going to take care of this guy, right? And he wouldn't tolerate, let's say, bad language in front of my mom. Yeah, dude, if you let loose or something and mom was around the corner, or if he heard somebody else that he didn't even know, even my friends laugh about. I'll tell you a funny story. The guy was actually talking to on the phone, childhood friend.
Mike Edge [00:25:17]:
But we used to have these big Thanksgiving Day. It was like during college, but you come home, and everybody come home to our town. And then my parents would allow us to have a party before Thanksgiving, the eve of. So everybody just kind of route up because they're back home. And we were having this party one time, and sometime we had a pool table in the basement, so we'd have a pool tournament. Well, my dad would get in it, and he was a great pool player. He grew up playing pool, and he loved beating us young guys, just smacking us around. So anyway, we had these pipes that hung out of the ceiling, but it was a drywall ceiling, so they would hang out.
Mike Edge [00:25:55]:
But if you pulled on them, it could crack the ceiling a little bit. So one of the girls we grew up with brought her cousin home, and she's good looking, and my buddy's like, man, I got to get over there and talk to this girl. So he's over there trying to smoosh her and everything, and he's sitting there talking to her. Well, he puts his hand up on this pipe. Now he's grown up like a brother at our house. My dad walks by, he goes, hey, Christopher. He goes, if you don't mind, take your hand off that pipe. I'm sorry, Mr.
Mike Edge [00:26:20]:
He said. Anyway, he passed. Kept doing it. Well, my dad walks by about three minutes later, and that dumb head, he's got his hand back up on that pipe. And my dad goes, Christopher, I thought I told you, man. Please take your hand off that pipe. It's going to crack that ceiling. That dumb guy.
Mike Edge [00:26:40]:
Five minutes later, Dad's over there playing pool, and he looks up, he sees we're doing this.
Lucas Underwood [00:26:45]:
Oh, God.
Mike Edge [00:26:46]:
I swear this is where my dad. It seemed like the music stopped and everybody stopped, but he goes full bore. Goes CRISpr. I told you to get your hand off that pipe. I'm not going to tell you again. And he treats him just like he would have know three times. Dude, you should have seen the girl that he was talking to. She just walks off like, you're a loser.
Mike Edge [00:27:09]:
But that was my mean. He gave him a fair shake, right? Exactly. And even my Fred talks about us to this day. He goes, dude, your dad, he goes, he was awesome. But, man, when he came down, it was.
Lucas Underwood [00:27:19]:
He was going to be firm. He was going to very direct and very clear. We're afraid of doing that. Know, like I said, small town America. That's where I grew up, and that's how they were. And you didn't get many chances to disrespect somebody, and you didn't disrespect somebody else in the store or somewhere else. You see a lot of vagrants now, in my town, I'm going to tell you right now, you can mouth off, but those folks have not fared well in our town for that very reason, because the old men of our town will not tolerate it. And they might be old men, but the problem with an old man is he knows he can't whip your ass.
Lucas Underwood [00:28:03]:
He'll just shoot you.
Mike Edge [00:28:06]:
They do things that will just hurt you, right? They don't have a lot of stamina, so they know that, right?
Lucas Underwood [00:28:12]:
And they don't have patience, either. That left long ago.
Mike Edge [00:28:16]:
Listen, you'll love this story, too. I love telling stories about my dad because he was funny. But one time we had this situation that happened at the house. SO there's five boys and my brother that's a year behind me, and I, we were the two oldest boys and then the three youngest. We were home from college or whatever. I don't know how we got them instigated, and we got a wrestling match or something going in the living room. Well, dad, we didn't know he was in the house, right? He yells for us, and we go back to his room. He's sitting in his chair.
Mike Edge [00:28:39]:
He goes, how many times I got to tell you all not fighting the house? He goes, I don't care if you go out in the backyard and beat the hell out of each other. Don't do it in my house, right? This my house. I don't want you tearing up the house. And of course, James and I, my brother behind me, I think one of us spoke up, and he goes, I know it wasn't your fault. He goes, but I heard both of y'all instigate it and got these boys going. And anyway, he said, you three leave. And he tells the three youngest to leave. And then we're standing there, and he goes, looks around, he gets up on the edge of his chair, and he goes, I'm going to admit something to you all that I didn't know if I was ready to admit yet.
Mike Edge [00:29:11]:
He said, you all probably whip my ass now, right? Well, I wasn't even thinking that. I was like, really?
Lucas Underwood [00:29:16]:
Let's try.
Mike Edge [00:29:18]:
I didn't want that of him because I was still intimidated by the bail. I was intimidated by him. But I was thinking, oh, you really think so? Okay. And then he goes, but I'm going to tell you something. If we tango, he said, I'm not going to mess around with you. He goes, I'm going to hit you so hard, you're going to hurt the rest of your life.
Lucas Underwood [00:29:33]:
Right?
Mike Edge [00:29:33]:
He goes, now get out of here. So we leaving. And my brother looks at me and goes, damn, that's the most intimidating thing I've ever heard. And I go, what part? He goes, we're going to win, but we're going to hurt the rest of our life.
Lucas Underwood [00:29:44]:
I know, right?
Mike Edge [00:29:45]:
It was such a great way to deliver the message.
Lucas Underwood [00:29:47]:
Yeah, you're going to remember this forever.
Mike Edge [00:29:49]:
And it was just like it kept that doubt in your head.
Lucas Underwood [00:29:52]:
Yeah, man. I don't know. I think that there's something different about society now, and people are afraid to be that way because they're afraid of the litigious nature of society as a whole.
Mike Edge [00:30:03]:
Well, what we've done is we've pretended like kids have that many rights. Like, parents can't be parents. I mean, we're giving kids big decision making power over anything, and it's just like, no, they're not mature enough. They need somebody to guide them. And I thank God my dad was that way. I call him like the big boy. He wasn't a big man. He was a stocky guy, but he just kept that attitude.
Mike Edge [00:30:26]:
No, you're in my house. We have all the fun we want. And my dad was a fun loving guy. I mean, I'll give you an example. So this is my brother. That's John. That's two down from me. He smart off to my dad one time, and, I mean, it sounded like a smart, eloquent remark, where my brother James and I would have been like, we looked at each other like, gosh dang, we got our heads slapped for that one, right? So James speaks up and he goes, well, dad, you'd bust our ass if we had said that to you.
Mike Edge [00:30:55]:
My dad doesn't miss a beat. And he goes, well, some people know how to say something funny and some people don't.
Lucas Underwood [00:31:00]:
Like, you didn't apologize, David.
Mike Edge [00:31:04]:
So we just looked at each other. We're like, we can't win.
Lucas Underwood [00:31:08]:
There's nothing we're ever going to do well, how'd you get into the tire business? I know, it's marketing, right? Yeah, you do marketing, but how did you end up here?
Mike Edge [00:31:20]:
So it's kind of a long story, but in the 1990s, I was in industrial sales and then got into Internet marketing kind of when Google came into existence. Google started in 98, but it really didn't kind of start hitting the scene until 2002, where people knew about it for really business reasons, because it was an algorithm. Everybody else was a directory. You had Lycos, Alta Vista, Yahoo. All those were directories where people sat around a table like this and said, well, we're going to rank that one. We're going to rank this one. And it was a decision by human means before you had the AI factor involved. And then as it came into being, I worked for a group called Thomas Register.
Mike Edge [00:32:02]:
I don't know if you know who they are.
Lucas Underwood [00:32:03]:
I do.
Mike Edge [00:32:03]:
Okay.
Lucas Underwood [00:32:03]:
I absolutely do. All right. My daddy had them booked that 1800 number you could call.
Mike Edge [00:32:09]:
Okay.
Lucas Underwood [00:32:10]:
Could find anything in the world. I think he still got.
Mike Edge [00:32:13]:
They were the industrial Google in print.
Lucas Underwood [00:32:16]:
Dude, there was so much cool stuff. Do you ever have one? You know what I'm talking.
David Roman [00:32:20]:
No idea what you're talking about.
Mike Edge [00:32:22]:
They were out of New York, though. They're a family owned company, but they controlled the industrial environment's marketing belong. If you weren't in that book, you didn't exist. And they knew it. And as marketers, they knew that. Hey, your competitors down the road, the metal stamper. Yeah, he's in here. He's got a full page ad.
Mike Edge [00:32:41]:
Well, now you think you got to buy a full page ad to keep up, right? And they kept people in that cycle. But then, lo and behold, the Internet came out and it caught them by surprise, because basically for almost 100 years, they were the only directory in the United States.
Lucas Underwood [00:32:57]:
They were pumps for forced water, hot water stuff.
Mike Edge [00:33:02]:
You want to find pumps. They were in there, and there was.
Lucas Underwood [00:33:05]:
A very specific page just for that. You'd pick up the telephone call and it's the only place in the country you could find the people who made those pumps.
Mike Edge [00:33:11]:
Correct.
Lucas Underwood [00:33:11]:
And there was nowhere else to look.
Mike Edge [00:33:13]:
I was representing them in the industrial space. Yeah. And then I had a customer say, dude, I see Thomas all over the Internet, this Google thing, and he goes, how do I get ranked up there with them? I said, I don't know. I'm your Thomas rep. What I know about that, the Internet was just really just getting started. And he goes, well, you're the closest thing I know, to an Internet guy, he said, can you find out? All right. So I called my superior up in know I'm out of Kentucky and he says, well, we got a guy that actually works for Thomas that does it for Thomas. And he's a pretty sharp guy.
Mike Edge [00:33:53]:
He's out of Cincinnati. And so I said, all right. He gave me his number. So I called him. I said, look, I don't know you from aDam. You don't know me. I know you represent Thomas over there. And he'd been a senior rep over there, the state of Ohio for a long time, but he had gotten in this technology at that time, it was just so brand new.
Mike Edge [00:34:10]:
He told me about his story and he was building industrial platforms and websites for manufacturers and trying to get them found out there in search directories at that time. And then now you got this search engine. And I just said, look, I got a few people asking about how to get found. Do you want to know who they are and can I just pass them on to you? He said, yeah, sure. Appreciate that. So I just said, all right. So I'd go to these existing Thomas clients, pass it on. And one of them happened to be Jasper engines transmissions.
Mike Edge [00:34:43]:
And in that process I had been industrial sales. So I told my wife, if this little company out of Cincinnati can impress Jasper, who I always knew had, they were just very due diligent on who their vendors, they're very strict. That is a quality control from top to bottom, east to west, really tightly ran organization.
Lucas Underwood [00:35:06]:
Yes, I'll give them that.
Mike Edge [00:35:07]:
So in our tri state area, they've always had that kind of mystique as a super prestigious just known. So let me back up just real quick. I told these two clients, one of which signed up with this group out of Cincinnati that I worked for at the time. I didn't. And he wanted to try it out, so he did well in the process. I could see things going well. And then I'd mentioned this group's name to Jasper Engines. And Jasper at the time was just kind of like, why would we deal with a little bitty marketing company out of Cincinnati when our entire marketing division is bigger than them? I mean, we know what we're know, this is our business.
Mike Edge [00:35:49]:
Well, I gave him a few things. I said, well, I can't find you under the word remanufacturing engines and that's what you guys do and you're basically one of the big players. I can't find you for rebuilt transmissions or anything like that. And he said, well, you make a good point there, and we had this little discussion. He said, all right, I'd be interested in talking to him. So they come in, they give a spiel, they impress Jasper, they do a contract. At first they signed something up, like do kind of an audit. They liked it so much, they said, all right, we're going to do a contract.
Mike Edge [00:36:20]:
Well, I remember telling my wife in that process, I said, if this dude over in Cincinnati can impress Jasper, I don't know what he's doing, but I know that it's the future, but I know if he can impress Jasper, they'll put him through the test, they'll scrutinize him for me to validate it.
Lucas Underwood [00:36:35]:
Exactly.
Mike Edge [00:36:36]:
And then I said, I'm going to go back to him and ask him if he wants somebody to rep him over here. So I ended up repping Thomas and him simultaneously because we were independent contractors when we sold for each Thomas. So then fast forward a year. One of the clients said, hey, man, I come back in for the Thomas Renewal. I'm laying it all out. This is where you're at right now. What do you want to do this year? He said, well, I got good news and bad news for you. So what's that? He said, bad news is I don't want to renew my Thomas.
Lucas Underwood [00:37:03]:
I said, what?
Mike Edge [00:37:05]:
He goes, but good news is I want to renew this other thing. And I said, whoa. I said, the reason you got the other thing was because you were in Thomas. I wasn't trying to compete. He goes, I know where you're coming from, but you got to understand my data. He said, I'm getting five to one over here by myself being ranked by these guys in Google than I am through Thomas. So it just validated it even more. And I told my wife, I said, I can't have this conflict of interest because I said, not that it really is.
Mike Edge [00:37:35]:
It's a compliment. But at the same time, when a guy has one budget, he's got to make a decision. This is the future. So that's where I went. And then we did such a good job for Tom or Jasper engines that it led me to a group out of Lexington, Kentucky, called SNs Tire. I don't know if you're familiar with those guys.
Lucas Underwood [00:37:53]:
I'm not.
Mike Edge [00:37:54]:
They're down here in the Southeast somewhat. And then they ended up signing up and I ended up being their main Internet guy. And I would just travel the country and just give lectures on why and what you need to do to be online. Right? Well, of course, I didn't even do it in a sales way. It was just educational. But they also knew I'd get leads out of it. So as soon as I'd come off that stage or whatever, and I'd be going to get coffee, here come five tire dealers. Hey, can you come see me? Yeah, exactly.
Mike Edge [00:38:24]:
And then I'd pick up business that way. But I was in a split atmosphere. I was still doing manufacturing and tire and automotive. And then my boss, he hit 60. You could tell he was slowing down, whatever. And then we were in the tire business quite a bit. And then as he slowed down, I could tell we weren't going to be hitting the gas pedal like we had been. And I kind of got burnt out.
Mike Edge [00:38:48]:
So I stepped away for a little bit. Then I got a call about three years ago, introduced me to tread partners. And I guess like they said, the rest is history. But they draw me back into the business. And now all I do is my favorite segment which is tires and automotive repair. And then we specialize with just multi store operations. So you got to have, usually there's exceptions to every rule, but usually our baseline is five stores or more. Right, because those guys don't know it, but they have one brand yet they have really five different operations.
Mike Edge [00:39:22]:
Does that make sense? Yeah, of course, because they may acquired.
Lucas Underwood [00:39:26]:
A store over here.
Mike Edge [00:39:27]:
It was known for the mechanic that's inside there and 80% of their revenue is service. But then over here they got a store that's doing 80% entire. How do you market those under one umbrella when basically you got one brand but you got two completely different operations?
Lucas Underwood [00:39:46]:
How do you do? You know, we've talked a lot about that even on our show, talking about the fact that it is a completely different animal once you get to that point. And we've both talked about like David does have two stories, it's a little bit different concept, but I've been back and forth and said, I don't know that I want multiple because like that's a lot to manage, that's a lot to do. Now where does Neil play into all that?
Mike Edge [00:40:12]:
So Neil is co founder and co owner of Tread Partners. And he used to own know with he, he, when he got bought out, he said, I knew I still liked the space and I liked automotive, but I really liked the marketing side. I had figured out some things there that I really liked. So he went in and became partners with another guy that was from an automotive background. And they were acting as general practitioners at first, but even half their business was automotive. Then one day they looked up a few couple of years ago, and they said, look, let's just be 100% automotive. We know that's our space. We know that we love it.
Mike Edge [00:40:49]:
We understand it. It's like our comfort zone. Every phone call is easy for us in the sense of being able to relate with people versus when you deal with, say, 50 different manufacturers, man, it's like a stress factor because you're trying to, what do they make and how do they make it? And I got to keep up with it and keep up with it. And then every call is different, whereas now every call is literally, it's not the same, but it's the same topic.
Lucas Underwood [00:41:15]:
So it's a sweet spot. So I was telling David when we went into, and I'm not in that space, so I can brag on him, right? A while back, Neil was added to the AStA board, which I'm on, and I was a little skeptical because Mike was like, this dude really knows his stuff. And a lot of times you hear people say like, oh, yeah, these people know their stuff. You know what I'm saying? Dude, he came onto that board and a, the tact with which he handles things is extremely unique.
Mike Edge [00:41:52]:
Yes.
Lucas Underwood [00:41:52]:
And he is so well spoken, and he is so able to navigate very complex situations and make people feel like, yes, hey, everything's okay, but let me talk to you about this, right? Very skilled communicator, like next level communicator.
Mike Edge [00:42:10]:
So let me add to that. When I was introduced to him, the guy that called me, called me out of Blue, and he sAid, hey, would you ever consider getting back in the industry, but strictly entire and automotive? Because I know you love that side of it the most. And I said, I never thought about it before because, I mean, I'm just doing my thing, right, and I'm raising my family. And he goes, well, think about it. And I'm like, well, the problem would be, is who is the company and are they really good at what they do? Because I know everybody can show case studies and everybody can say they do this, and I'm just like, a customer. How do I know you know what you're going to do? Even though I've been in the business, the only way I can see it is I got to see you in action. And usually that's through a process. I've got to go through a process with you.
Mike Edge [00:42:50]:
He goes, trust me, Neil knows his stuff. It's his background. ET. So. But then when I met Neil, I had the same impression you did.
Lucas Underwood [00:42:57]:
Yeah.
Mike Edge [00:42:58]:
And I was like, all right, this guy, he's different.
Lucas Underwood [00:43:01]:
Yeah, he really is. And so he comes onto the board and somehow we get on to marketing and I'm like, holy cow, this dude. Listen. We listen to a lot of marketing presentations and we hear a lot of people talk about marketing. Boys, when Neil starts dropping truth on know we've got great friends who are doing great work in the marketing space, amazing things. But when it comes to MSO and it comes to these stores, specifically in the tire space.
Mike Edge [00:43:31]:
Oh, yeah.
Lucas Underwood [00:43:34]:
It's almost like not only does he understand the consumer and in his head he can think what they're thinking, but he understands the multi shop owner perspective. And so he's thinking through what it is they're thinking.
Mike Edge [00:43:48]:
Yes.
Lucas Underwood [00:43:48]:
And so I've watched him sit down and develop strategies, even just for this association, and he'll listen. And this is what's so neat about him, because he will sit and he will listen to what someone's saying and he will not say a word. He'll just be sitting there listening. And then all of a sudden he opens his mouth and starts pouring out knowledge and there's no way to refute.
Mike Edge [00:44:09]:
Well, what he does really well is he'll Ask you questions that cause you to think, oh, maybe I don't know what I thought was right exactly, but it's just a question.
Lucas Underwood [00:44:20]:
Yeah. And by the time you get done, that is the exact scenario I witnessed, because he's asking questions. And then all of a sudden, once he's asked you enough questions for you to realize that you are a fool and you have no clue what you're talking about, then he lays the truth out for you in such a way you're like, oh, that makes sense.
Mike Edge [00:44:40]:
Why didn't I think of that?
Lucas Underwood [00:44:42]:
Right? Exactly.
Mike Edge [00:44:44]:
He's another cool thing about Neil is that, well, and his partner Dave too. But when we represent our company out there, it's not. I don't know how to describe it. We don't want to sell you. I don't want to have to sell you. I want to educate you and I want you to understand where we're coming from. And then hopefully what you see is I want these guys as a partner. That's why we got the name in there.
Mike Edge [00:45:06]:
Tread partners. Right. We want you to look at us as a partner long term, and we're going to truly, genuinely make your business better because we're not in it for a transaction. We're literally in it to help you win in your space. There's, look, there's a lot of things that we're not good at, and we know that, but it comes with a little maturity. And that's another thing I like about Neil, is he's willing to admit what he doesn't know, but he knows where to get you a resource to help.
Lucas Underwood [00:45:36]:
You with that problem.
Mike Edge [00:45:38]:
And he'll bring that in. He'll. I don't. We don't do that in house, but I've got somebody. You need to talk. Yeah. And that's where people really respect Neil because he doesn't try to be all things to all people. He says, look, this is our.
Mike Edge [00:45:52]:
Yeah, but our other wheelhouse is recognizing that you need this, and we'll get you in touch with these people.
Lucas Underwood [00:45:58]:
Right. So what is it exactly that you guys specialize in as far as marketing? When you go, you're looking at a tire store. They got multiple shops right now. They're probably going 50 different directions with marketing. They've got somebody doing Seo, they've got somebody doing all of these little pieces here, there, everywhere. And they're targeting a blanket audience. Okay, so I'll give you an example. There's a tire store in my town, and they're basically putting ads out on Facebook that says, we sell tires.
Lucas Underwood [00:46:31]:
And it's got a picture of a tire. It's got a link you can click to their website. No prices on the tires. It just shows you these are the tires. We sell these brands. And you can look at the different models of tires. And that's the extent of the marketing that they do now. They're a one shop operation, and they stay extremely busy.
Lucas Underwood [00:46:49]:
They stay lined up out the door. What's different about what you do with your shops? Because hearing Neil talk about it, it seems like a very specialized process. It does not seem like what David and I do to market our shops. There's like, true intelligence. And I'm not saying we're not using intelligence to market our shops. I'm saying that there's true intelligence built around the MSO, the exact client that that shop in that area with that team is looking for.
Mike Edge [00:47:22]:
Here's the challenge that people have with MSOs. So they usually have one bucket of their budget. And let's say that bucket is going to be used for SEO and pay per click or Google Adwords, right? Well, they throw all five stores, or let's say ten stores into that bucket, and then when that bucket is evaporated for that month, they're no longer on Google spending for those sponsored ad links. Okay. What happens is it could only be one or two stores taking that bucket from that bucket, but they don't know that because they don't granularize it. And it's amazing. We've run into organizations that have 30 plus operations, and it's all still one big bucket. And so what we do is we break it up into looking at the individual market and the zip codes that you should be buying ads in.
Mike Edge [00:48:11]:
Some of them you don't want to be buying ads in. And then sometimes we get a hold of these accounts and we've seen people be buying ads that are 5100 miles away from their home.
David Roman [00:48:21]:
Right.
Mike Edge [00:48:21]:
You ain't never going to get that client. Yeah. You know what I'm saying? Exactly. But they didn't know that. They didn't have geographic parameters in place for that one location or all their locations, or they didn't break it up granular where they had. We may have individual buckets for each location, but we'll have individual buckets for each product service. So that way, one product service isn't going to steal from the next one. Then when you look at the data, you go, oh, we got leftover bucket money over in this one.
Mike Edge [00:48:50]:
He's never going to use that. So we can put his money over here. So now we're managing that client's budget inside a sweet spot where they don't get hurt. We're not saying, oh, you got to spend more money because you ran out. We're saying, no, you didn't shift money. You're not in a bad spot, you're just not using it. Right. Right.
Mike Edge [00:49:07]:
I think our expertise comes down to cost per acquisition, because the least expensive way to acquire a new customer is actually online. But if you've had a bad experience that way, you think, I think my postcards are still the best route, or I think sponsoring all those high school teams in my area are the best route or whatever, but the least expensive, most productive way and efficient way is still online. And it's all about management of that money and how you break it up so you can discern what you're going. For instance, we talked about earlier, you got that one store doing 80% service, and you got the other store doing 80% tire. Well, you got a completely different. They can't draw from the same bucket of money. You got to break them up completely because he's going after a different market over here. And you can still go after tires.
Mike Edge [00:50:00]:
I mean, you're not trying to give up on tires, right. You just don't want to lose ground on the service side that you've already gained. Right, exactly. So let's figure out a way that you're still managing that. Right. But you're know, robbing from Paul to pay. Yeah. What does that help?
Lucas Underwood [00:50:14]:
Of course. What do you think about that when you hear thaT?
David Roman [00:50:17]:
Sounds smart.
Lucas Underwood [00:50:19]:
Are you doing that?
David Roman [00:50:21]:
I have one individual budget.
Lucas Underwood [00:50:23]:
No, I know you have one location, but are you thinking about it in that drilled down way?
David Roman [00:50:28]:
You have to. With a small budget in a small shop, you don't have a choice. I had a shop owner, super Smart guy. He got really upset because I disagreed with him on using billboards. And I'm like, what kind of messaging you? Like, you're one shop, one location, and you are trying to narrow this thing down like you're saying to a very tight area and you're going to throw a billboard up with your phone number on it. How many of those people in that small area that you need to pull from are actually driving by and looking at that? So you're blasting this message out to a million people and you should be targeting 10,000.
Mike Edge [00:51:09]:
Right.
David Roman [00:51:10]:
So why waste the money?
Mike Edge [00:51:11]:
And you have to pay for the million people.
David Roman [00:51:13]:
Yeah, you're paying for the million people.
Mike Edge [00:51:15]:
Because Lamar advertising is not going to give it to you at a discount.
David Roman [00:51:18]:
No, not at all. You have to be very.
Mike Edge [00:51:23]:
That's interesting. You brought up billboard. I used to do this. And when I give these seminars about being in, I call it your being in your online space or your information space. So you need to dominate your information space and quit thinking of the Internet as one big ocean. You're only in a harbor, so you want to dominate that harbor, the harbor you exist in. And so if you think about it, like the superhighways, for instance, the Internet, for instance, you bring up billboards. McDonald's and Cracker Barrel do great putting up billboards on the interstates because they know drivers are going down that interstate and they know they're going to be hungry.
Mike Edge [00:51:57]:
And they got a couple of exits coming up before you get to them. And that billboard is sitting there and it reminds them you're hungry. And we got your food up here at the next 5 miles. So that person is thinking, oh, I got to go to the bathroom anyway, or I got to get gas, I might as well get something to eat. That's smart advertising. But for the guy that has the auto repair shop or tire shop, well, every car that passes by there, yeah, they could potentially be hungry. Right? You eat every day, but you don't need auto repair every day. So it's poor advertising because you're paying for the traffic.
Mike Edge [00:52:31]:
Lamar is selling it off traffic or any of those advertising billboard companies. But what you're doing with the Internet is you're only paying if you do it right. You're only paying for the information space that you want to belong in to the audience that you want to belong to. So I'll give you another example. We've used upwards of 4000 negative keywords in Google before for one account. Do you know what a negative keyword is? Yeah. So if you were a general practitioner, which I came from in marketing, how would you know to put that many in for the tire business so that you don't get the wrong inquiries and you get more narrowly focused because how many people say they sell tires? Well, if you say you sell tires, guess what? You're going to end up getting the motorcycle tire person. Well, you don't want that guy, right.
Mike Edge [00:53:20]:
It's just a waste of time on your phone and you wasted that pay per click.
Lucas Underwood [00:53:24]:
Yeah, throw money away.
Mike Edge [00:53:25]:
You've got to figure out the angles that you're trying to take inside the tire business. And I think when we know that we're coming into an account and they've had a general practitioner, we already know we have a leg up because we know the tire business and the auto repair business right now they may have one client in the auto repair and tire, but we have tons of rooftops and multilocations. And if we know that they've only dealt with one, let's say they have it on their website, our clientele or portfolio, and they've got one client, we already know that we've got a distinct advantage. It's just give us an opportunity to tell you what we might be able to do for you. And again, I don't want to sell you because if I got to sell you, then you're not seeing it right. You got to understand it because it's going to be a long term relationship.
Lucas Underwood [00:54:07]:
100%. Yeah, 100%.
David Roman [00:54:09]:
Are you focusing in on mostly Google and then add in Facebook as a kicker or as a reminder that we're, hey, we're here. So you're targeting the I need it right now on Google and then brand awareness on Facebook?
Mike Edge [00:54:24]:
Correct. We do the ad buying on all the social media. We don't do the organic posting or anything like that because we tell them you're better off just doing it in house. But the ad buying we do. And that's meant to support what you're doing out there on Google. But you got to remember our sale in the tire and the auto repair space, nobody's a happy about mean. And it's different than wheels because when you buy wheels, you're kind of excited.
Lucas Underwood [00:54:51]:
You want these nice new wheels, but.
Mike Edge [00:54:53]:
In our space, it's not a happy purchase. So they're usually looking for a fix to a problem. So it's not a happy problem. So the social media supports, or the social media ads support that recognition. Oh, I saw them out on Google and I just came here and I still have that problem that kind of reinforces that brand or the service they're offering or whatever. But when they go to Google and they type that query in, that is a clear intention of what their problem is today. Check engine light, who can help me, basically, or alignment problem.
Lucas Underwood [00:55:31]:
I need help and I need help.
Mike Edge [00:55:33]:
Or I need new tires or whatever it may be. But they're usually sourcing because they're going to buy relatively quickly versus, say, if you're a golfer and you're looking up a golf bag or new clubs, you don't need to buy today. You're just shopping. But if you're usually looking up a problem, you're close to buying today.
Lucas Underwood [00:55:55]:
That's a really interesting point, is that I don't think many of us small single shops, because I don't want to say transactional. That's not what I'm getting at. But we talk.
David Roman [00:56:10]:
It's a sales funnel, dear. It's a sales funnel.
Mike Edge [00:56:13]:
No.
David Roman [00:56:13]:
Where are you targeting that person along that sales funnel?
Lucas Underwood [00:56:19]:
I guess my point, though, is that we hear so many of these single shop owners say, I'm out two weeks, I'm out three weeks, I'm out a month. One of the things that no one waiting a month.
David Roman [00:56:34]:
That's why I tell them all immediately, ain't no one waiting a month to get their water pump fixed. What are you doing?
Lucas Underwood [00:56:39]:
Well, that guy that popped up in that class was, well, I'm out a month and my clients are waiting for me.
David Roman [00:56:45]:
No, they're not.
Lucas Underwood [00:56:46]:
No, there's just no data to suggest that's the case.
Mike Edge [00:56:51]:
No, they're not. I mean, we run is what they are. We run an engagement reengagement program. So this is after acquisition stuff, but we run a reengagement program where we go after a shop's best lost customers. So we look at their ARO, see what that spend is, how many times they have been there and when was their last visit. If it's six months to 24 months, then we want to go back after them. And we use a tool called IP targeting. It's not programmatic advertising where you're following somebody.
Mike Edge [00:57:23]:
It's literally getting their IP address, understanding where they are exactly, and then sending them a direct ad saying, we miss you, or here's a $50 discount unlimit on whatever you do coming back. Because we already know what their AR is. We're content with that.
David Roman [00:57:41]:
But the results that we got, really smart.
Mike Edge [00:57:43]:
It is, well, the results that we've gotten off of it. Yeah, we guarantee it. Ten to one. Yeah. I've been in this marketing space forever. I've never seen anybody guarantee anything. And so I told Neil one time, I said, well, how can we promote this to new people? Because I get how we can do it. People in our stable already, we're just, hey, you need to do this.
Mike Edge [00:58:03]:
And here's what's going to happen. Well, by law, I don't know what politician came up with it, but they say you got to have at least 500 targets so that it's not individualizing and targeting. Right. So as long as we got 500 best lost customers, we go after them, we target them, we got a strategy about it. But within, we'd run the program for 90 days, but we measure it for 120 because spillover, we're saying within those 500 customers, out of that spend that you do, you're going to receive a ten to one return on investment within 120 days.
Lucas Underwood [00:58:39]:
I mean, tHat's pretty impressive.
Mike Edge [00:58:40]:
Oh, it blows my mind. But Neil said one day when we did it, he goes, I think I'm going to have to put a guarantee on this. I said, what are you comfortable with? And I said, first of all, why would you do that? And he said, well, because I was a shop owner and I'm not going to listen to you if you came in and told me something about this, because first of all, I ain't going to believe you. He goes, but if you're guaranteeing it, you've got my attention because I'm too busy dealing with other stuff. But if you can inject into my arm right, then it's like getting a shot in the arm. Steroid to your business, cash coming back. These people already exist in my pos. Well, hell, why wouldn't I go back after them right now and they're guaranteeing my money?
Lucas Underwood [00:59:13]:
Yeah.
Mike Edge [00:59:15]:
And then the reason I asked Neil, I said, well, why would you do a ten to one? He said, well, I've been running this thing for at least two years before you came in. And he said, and I've never gotten less than ten to one. And I said, what are you, some kind of idiot?
Lucas Underwood [00:59:26]:
I said, this is a product, right?
Mike Edge [00:59:27]:
This is its own package. He goes, well, I just never looked at it that way because we were always focused on acquisition. That's what people. But he goes, I always thought it would be a tougher sell by itself.
Lucas Underwood [00:59:36]:
Itself.
Mike Edge [00:59:36]:
So anyway, we've stripped it out and we call it retread. And it's just kind of a little play on words. But we go back after your best lost customers, and it's one of the coolest things. And Neil and I sit there and we're in awe when we watch it work, because we're like, will it work this time? It's never failed. Neil goes, maybe one day we get our handcut in the cookie jar, we got to pay it out. But typically, it's like Neil said. He goes, if I had to pay it out, I'd just say, look, let me run the program another two weeks for free because you're going to get your money back. But I mean, bottom line is we've run it where they.
Mike Edge [01:00:08]:
So the minimum spend on it. If you run 500 names, it cost you $3,750.
Lucas Underwood [01:00:14]:
That ain't bad for 90 days.
Mike Edge [01:00:15]:
THat's the total cost. It's cheap, right? And we're saying within that 120 days, you're going to see $37,500 back from that list that you can match back real easy. So when you think about marketing people, I had this one lady one time, it was kind of funny. She goes, well, what's the redemption rate on the discount that you send out? I said, ma'am, it doesn't matter. You don't even care about the redemption rate. I'm going to show you the matchback of the cash back in your drawer. Of course, her boss goes, yeah, that's the only thing the dealer cares about. They don't care about the redemption rate on the coupon.
Mike Edge [01:00:51]:
The irony is, and we think it's something to do with the subliminal effect of the marketing you're giving them because they're seeing these ads. But remember, it's an ad to a brand they're already familiar with and they've already spent money with. So both entities know each other, the person, and all you're doing is reminding them. Well, back to your point about would people wait on a water pump or something? No, they're not going to wait. They're going to go find somebody else. But the problem is they may have a good experience over there. And guess where they go, the next time they oil change or something, it doesn't mean you did something bad, but you need to remind them why they need to come back. So it's a very targeted way because this little device right here is always in their hands.
Mike Edge [01:01:33]:
And they're getting an ad on that. They don't know they're getting the ad. They may even see the discount and they don't know it's personalized to them. They just see, oh, I'll get $50 off next time. But they don't even clip it. They just remember it's Joe's tire shop. And then they look at it and they just go, oh, then they see it tomorrow and they see it the next day and they're like, yeah, I do need new tires.
Lucas Underwood [01:01:52]:
I'm going back to Joe's.
Mike Edge [01:01:53]:
And they don't even know why, but they forgot about the coupon. So the irony is we laugh about it, but we're like, it's the first time you're actually cheering for the fact that yoU're not getting redemptions. They're just coming back. Yeah, so it's a really cool program.
Lucas Underwood [01:02:07]:
And I've seen that a lot. Even just in mailers that we've done recently is they don't use the coupon. They just come back and say, hey, I got a mailer. Yeah, right.
David Roman [01:02:16]:
But this is an even better list. It's always the existing customer list, especially less than 24 months old, and you start sending them something.
Mike Edge [01:02:25]:
Well, we also qualify it too, by what was their average ARo. We don't want just the people that came for us to us for oil changes or state inspection. Yes. We look at it and go, well, their average span was $70.
David Roman [01:02:39]:
The only thing I found that would keep me from targeting absolutely everybody is that my second visit is six times higher than the initial visit. So if they were just a one timer and they spent $100 with me, all of my effort is going to be into getting them in a second time because I know they're going to end up spending me $600 on the second visit, and then on the third visit, it can get up to $2,400. And so over those three visits, ends up being a pretty good aro. If you just go off that one visit, you might look at it and go, well, I'm just going to go ahead and ignore them when it might be something that you just need.
Mike Edge [01:03:20]:
And I don't argue with that. But where we're coming from is if we're going to guarantee it by ten to one margin. We want to know your best lost customer.
Lucas Underwood [01:03:27]:
Yeah, for sure.
Mike Edge [01:03:29]:
And usually he drifted away because he couldn't get in the bay for one day or something happened, and then he's just distracted. He had a good experience somewhere else. We're just saying, hey, throwing that little lob out there to get him back and remind him, hey, you still have a relationship over here. You've been here six times in the last three years. It's fascinating how it works, but we think it's because. I never watched the TV series, but I remember what it was about. It was the Netflix. Mad Men.
Mike Edge [01:03:57]:
Did you watch it? Yeah. Okay. I didn't watch it, but I remember hearing about that.
Lucas Underwood [01:04:00]:
Good show. Good show.
Mike Edge [01:04:02]:
They knew. They ruled the world in regards to messaging because the TV at that time only had three channels. Yeah. So when you put a TV commercial out there, it had a profound effect on the audience. Well, the audience is dispersed today, right, in so many different directions, but not anymore. Through this phone right here. Turn around and come right back through this one device. I'm saying.
Mike Edge [01:04:24]:
And if we know that, we know the percentages of people going online every day for just information in Google, well, why shouldn't they see your ad and it be directed to an audience that you already qualified to do?
Lucas Underwood [01:04:36]:
That's right. Already have a relationship with.
Mike Edge [01:04:39]:
Awesome.
Lucas Underwood [01:04:39]:
Yeah, that was awesome.
Mike Edge [01:04:42]:
Oh, good.
